Jan. 20, 2026
S4E1 Your Biggest Climate Impact Is Not What You Think
We often think individual climate action is about small, visible choices — what we eat, what we recycle, or whether we switch off the lights.
But do those actions really matter most?
In the first episode of the new year, Wrishi Sutradhar and Carmine Fiume take a data-driven look at where personal emissions actually come from. Using concrete examples, we walk through the biggest drivers of individual climate impact: cars and mobility, flying, home energy and heating, food choices, and consumption.
Along the way, we unpack why some actions dominate emissions while others receive disproportionate attention — and why context matters so much. Where you live, how your energy is produced, your travel patterns, and your housing all shape your footprint in very different ways.
This episode isn’t about being a “perfect green consumer.”
It’s about understanding impact, prioritising the right levers, and moving the conversation away from guilt and toward agency.
If you’ve ever wondered where to actually focus your energy when it comes to climate action, this episode is a good place to start.
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Welcome to a new episode of
Sustainability Forward, also in
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the new year of 2026.
With me is my Co host Carmine
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Harmony.
How are you doing?
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Good Richie, looking forward to
this new year.
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Me too, me too.
Lots of things to discuss in the
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new year.
So I wanted to come and start by
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asking a very simple question,
probably a very pertinent
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question for New Year,
specifically for individuals as
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well.
When we talk about climate
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action as individuals, what's
the first thing that comes to
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your mind?
Probably is the time when we are
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recording, but I would say food,
meat, probably recycling, I
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don't know, switching off the
lights, yeah.
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My list is similar.
We've sent we spent years
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focusing on, you know, the
small, visible, tangible things.
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The ones that feel manageable
and even comforting sometimes.
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Yeah.
And I think today we want to ask
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Professor Lali uncomfortable
questions.
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Are those the action that really
move the needle?
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Yeah, good question.
Because as we kind of look into
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the data, something interesting
comes out.
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Some everyday habits which you
barely question, like how we
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move from one place to the
other, how we fly or how often
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we fly, how we heat our homes,
all that completely dominates
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our individual climate impact.
Yeah, and they're often missing
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from the mainstream conversation
or treated us too hard, too
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political or too disruptive to
touch.
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And that's why this episode is
not about being a perfect green
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consumer.
Yes, let's focus on impact,
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about understanding which
individual choices matter most
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and why society tends to talk
about the smaller ones instead.
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We will today walk through the
biggest drivers of personal
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admissions 1 by 1, using real
numbers and some real examples.
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And hopefully by the end of the
episode, you will walk away with
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a clearer answer to the simple
question, If I want to make a
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difference, where should I
actually focus my energy?
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Because climate action isn't
about doing everything.
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Yes.
And Richie, let's pulling the
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right lever, pulling the right
levers first.
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Yeah.
Our kind of first segment is
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about cars and mobility, which
we think is actually the
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biggest, biggest lever.
So let's start with what it is.
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So for many people, the single
biggest source of emissions in
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their daily lives is the car.
Yeah.
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And of course it really depends
on where you live with parts of
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the world, your daily life.
But for, for example, for from
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where me and you live, driving
feels normal routine, it's
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almost invisible.
And probably This is why it's
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climate impact is often
underestimated.
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Yeah.
So to make this discussion
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concrete, let's imagine a fairly
typical driver who drives about
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20,000 kilometers per year,
gasoline car consuming about 9
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liters of gasoline per 100
kilometers and maybe, yeah,
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consuming about 9 liters per 100
kilometer.
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Yeah, that's how I would say
that forms kind of the picture
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of a typical driver.
Yeah, this is around 1800 liters
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of fuel every day, every year.
Every year, I'd say, yeah, OK.
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And that translates to about
four tons of CO2 per year just
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from driving.
So around 4 tons per of CO2 per
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year.
That's already doubled the
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annual per person carbon target
carbon budget compatible with
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1.5° word.
And this even before we start
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talking about other emissions
such as flight, eating or food.
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OK, so just with the car, an
average driver has already
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doubled the budget very, very,
very important take away.
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OK, so now let's dive into the
SUV effect, right?
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How bigger heavier emissions
associated with driving are
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happening.
So when we when we zoom out and
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look at one of the biggest
trends of the last decade, it is
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in fact the explosion of SUVs,
the larger, bigger, more gas
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guzzling cars.
Yes.
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And interesting to see because
in the last decade, this segment
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has gone from a niche category
to around half of all new cars
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sales globally.
Yeah.
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And on average, these SUVs emit
about 20% more CO2 per kilometer
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than smaller comparable cars.
Yeah, they're heavier, lesser
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dynamic most of the time, and
often more powerful.
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That's what's needed for
everyday driving.
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And the scale of this trend is
what really matters.
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You know, there are hundreds of
millions of SUVs on the road
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worldwide, and depending on the
geography, might be even more
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dense in some parts of the world
than elsewhere.
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And probably you've seen this
kind of statistics somewhere
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else, but I found very
interesting.
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So if SUV owners were a country,
the combined emission will rank
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among the Wards top emitters on
the order of magnitude of major
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industrial economy.
Wow, that's a That's a very
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striking statistic that vehicle
choice at scale isn't just a
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marginal issue, it's actually a
climate system issue.
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And and crucially, the growth of
SUV has offset a large share of
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the efficiency gains made by
clear engines, development of
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technologies etcetera where the
last decade.
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Right now, the next point of
discussion on the topic of
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vehicles is around EVs.
At this point, actually, many
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people will ask, OK, but what if
my car itself is electric?
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What difference is that going to
make?
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Yeah, that's a fair question.
We know that an electric engine
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is more effective than an
internal combustion engine.
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So E VS do reduce emissions,
especially where electricity is
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low carbon.
But I think I mean we know there
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is a hierarchy that often gets
lost in this.
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Yeah.
So we should say probably no car
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at all is the scenario from
where your emission got really
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reduced.
The second best option would be
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driving much less.
Or if you really need to drive
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it for work or personal life,
electric car could have a better
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impact on emissions and only
after that a more efficient
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fossil car.
So an electric SUV is still
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heavy, resource intensive and
energy hungry, isn't it?
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So electric vehicles could help,
but they don't solve congestion,
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land use and other sheer scale
of car dependence.
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This is where.
Climate action stops being just
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about personal choices.
Yeah, because reducing car
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dependence means rethinking
cities, commuting infrastructure
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and public transportation.
Which is why it's talked about
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less than recycling or diet.
But if we are honest about where
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individual emissions really come
from, mobility is the first
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place to look, at least in few
parts of the world.
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Because, as we said in the
beginning, when it comes to
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climate impact, how we move
matters more than we like to
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admit.
The second aspect of moving is,
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of course, flying right?
If cars are the biggest source
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of emission spread across the
year, flying is slightly
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different.
Yeah, flying is like hitting the
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Fast forward button of your
carbon frequent.
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It's much more dense in shorter
period of time.
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That's right, you can do
everything right for months.
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Drive less and eat well.
Optimize your energy consumption
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and then one long haul flight
can wipe out all of that in a
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single day.
And let's look at the concrete
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example, something potentially
from an executive business
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traveller.
Yeah.
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So what again, I mean the
scenario that we imagine is 3
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return long haul flights per
year between London and Houston,
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probably this guy works in the
oil and gas industry plus 5
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medium distance flights within
within Europe.
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That adds up roughly 6 to 8 tons
per CO2 per year, depending on
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aircraft type and assumptions.
And that's just from flying
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because earlier we gave you the
impact from driving as well.
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And to put that in perspective,
that's more than the total
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annual emission of an average
person in many countries.
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Right now, even within flying
the there's a discussion of
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economy versus business, class
versus first class.
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This is where things truly get
uncomfortable because not all
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seats are equal.
I guess from an emissions
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perspective as well as from a
price perspective.
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Yeah, the plane emits roughly
the same total CO2 whatever is
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full of economy or business
passengers, but.
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Emissions are allocated per seat
and business and 1st class seats
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take up much more space and
wait.
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So one business class passenger
can be responsible for two to
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four times more emissions than
an economy passengers on the
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same flight.
And first class obviously can be
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even higher.
Which means the frequent Flyers
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in premium cabins have a
disproportionately large climate
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impact, even if they fly the
same roots.
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Right.
And as we have always maintained
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on this podcast, it is not just
about CO2 Aviation impact is
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much bigger than just the just
the CO2 footprint.
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Lanes releases emissions high in
atmosphere where they where they
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have an extra warming effect.
And then associated with flying
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are things like contrails,
nitrogen oxides, which can
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amplify warming beyond CO2
alone.
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So when scientists account for
these non CO2 effects, the total
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climate impact of flying can be
roughly 2 to three times higher
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than CO2 numbers suggest.
Which essentially means that
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aviation punches well above its
weight in terms of climate
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impact.
So what, Rishi?
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So what actually moves the
needle?
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Well, again, just like we did
before first flying less,
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there's no substitute for that.
Yeah.
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Second, fewer long haul flights
because longer flights dominate
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emissions.
Yeah.
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And the third in that order
would be choosing economy over
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premium cabins when flying is
unavoidable.
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Yeah.
And we know the aviation
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industry is moving forward with
sustainable aviation fuel,
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developing other technology.
This is helpful but there is
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still lot of work to do there.
Yeah.
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And I don't think carbon flying
is that bad because it's it's
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occasional.
Yeah, it's, as we said, it's
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extremely emission intensive per
hour, very intense.
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Yeah, or I think a relatively
small number of people, aviation
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alone can account for the
majority of their entire carbon
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footprint.
This is why when we talk about
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individual climate action,
flying always shows up near the
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top of the list.
Right.
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Let's move to another
interesting segment about which
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we've had some discussion on
this podcast in the last season.
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After cars and flying, there's a
big source of emissions that
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that's much less visible because
it happens quietly when we are
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at home and even when we are
not.
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At home and we did an episode
about it about home energy and
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heating.
Yes, we did.
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No drama, no engines, no airport
queue queues.
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And yet, for many household,
it's one of the largest sources
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of emissions.
So, and again, it depends on
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geographies, but we when we look
at, for example, Europe and
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North America, space heating and
hot water dominate the household
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energy use.
And in in many other countries.
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And that still means gas, oil,
or even coal.
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Burning fuel everyday all winter
long.
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A typical gas heated home can
easily emit 2 to 4 four tons of
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CO2 per year just for heating,
hot just for heating and for and
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for hot water.
Which is the same league as
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driving a car 10s of thousands
of kilometers, as we said
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before.
Yes, now the tricky part is that
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heating is the background
activity.
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Yeah.
So you have it on but but you
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don't feel it like you feel
driving or flying because you're
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not focusing on it.
Yeah, you casually set the
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thermostat once and the
emissions just keep flowing.
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And This is why eating is often
underestimating personal carbon
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footprint.
But it's also good to see a lot
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of companies moving this space
with intelligence, for example,
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temperature settings leveraging
AI technologies.
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Right.
So now within this segment, so
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heating, let's talk about what
really makes a difference.
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Yeah.
So for example, we know our
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energy efficiency is important,
so we can we can look at
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insulation for example.
Yes we can.
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Better insulation can can cut
heating by almost 30 to 60%,
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sometimes even more.
So that's not a left cycle
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sacrifice, that's a structural.
Fix.
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Yeah, it is a structural fix and
and it's something that needs to
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00:17:05,480 --> 00:17:09,200
be done.
The single biggest shift in this
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00:17:09,200 --> 00:17:14,240
segment, however, is moving from
fossil fuel based heating to
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00:17:14,240 --> 00:17:18,000
heat pumps.
Yeah, and if you remember the
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00:17:18,000 --> 00:17:20,599
episode we did also with Sylvan
last year, it pumps are
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00:17:20,599 --> 00:17:23,800
incredibly efficient, often
delivered in three to four units
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00:17:23,800 --> 00:17:26,200
of heat for every unit of
electricity.
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Yeah.
And as the electricity grid gets
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00:17:30,160 --> 00:17:34,680
cleaner, heating emissions
automatically fall.
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00:17:34,680 --> 00:17:36,760
So it's on.
It almost has a positive
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00:17:37,560 --> 00:17:42,000
positive cycle when the grid
gets cleaner.
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00:17:43,120 --> 00:17:45,920
And the differently from around
there, let's say application
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00:17:45,920 --> 00:17:49,000
industries, the technology is
there is ready to go.
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00:17:49,760 --> 00:17:56,080
Yeah, right.
And then we come to behaviors
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00:17:56,080 --> 00:17:59,640
related to heating, because
small changes still matter.
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00:18:02,280 --> 00:18:05,240
So looking at some statistics
there, for example, lowering the
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00:18:05,280 --> 00:18:10,760
thermostat by 1°C can reduce the
heating emissions by around 7%.
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00:18:11,720 --> 00:18:17,200
But and and this is an important
but behavior helps most after
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00:18:17,200 --> 00:18:19,920
the system itself is clean.
Yeah.
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00:18:21,160 --> 00:18:23,600
So it is a partner we're seeing
again.
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The as we've said again many,
many times in the episode in in
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00:18:29,640 --> 00:18:34,640
many, many areas, the biggest
wins aren't about big, massive
247
00:18:34,640 --> 00:18:38,720
choices, heroics or discipline.
It's.
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00:18:38,720 --> 00:18:43,880
About changing the system once
than letting it work everyday.
249
00:18:44,600 --> 00:18:49,480
So insulate once, electrify
once, decarbonize the grid once,
250
00:18:49,480 --> 00:18:51,320
to name a few.
Yeah.
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00:18:51,320 --> 00:18:53,800
And the savings repeat year
after year.
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00:18:55,120 --> 00:19:01,280
So you've never seen viral posts
about insulation because it's a
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00:19:01,280 --> 00:19:03,760
boring topic?
Yeah.
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00:19:03,760 --> 00:19:07,880
And that's also probably not
easy to understand sometimes.
255
00:19:09,040 --> 00:19:11,440
No one flexes an heat pump on
social media.
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00:19:11,480 --> 00:19:15,320
It's, as you said, consider
importing technology, but it's
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00:19:15,320 --> 00:19:17,400
quite effective.
Yeah.
258
00:19:17,680 --> 00:19:20,920
I mean, we did try to talk about
your heat pump experience on on
259
00:19:20,920 --> 00:19:23,680
this podcast.
So maybe maybe we are a bit
260
00:19:23,680 --> 00:19:26,040
different from the rest of the
crowd.
261
00:19:26,360 --> 00:19:31,760
But in terms of climate impact,
heating upgrades are often more
262
00:19:31,760 --> 00:19:35,720
powerful than many visible green
habits combined.
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00:19:37,200 --> 00:19:41,280
So let's go to a different
segment now, Rich.
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00:19:41,760 --> 00:19:48,360
Yeah, let's go to food and diet.
After cars, flights and heating
265
00:19:48,360 --> 00:19:51,200
that we've talked about, let's
talk a little bit about food
266
00:19:51,200 --> 00:19:53,720
itself.
Probably the area where climate
267
00:19:53,720 --> 00:19:59,480
conversation get emotional.
Yeah, and where guilt often runs
268
00:19:59,480 --> 00:20:02,040
ahead of ahead of data.
Yeah.
269
00:20:02,400 --> 00:20:07,960
So looking at some statistics,
food accounts for about 20 to
270
00:20:07,960 --> 00:20:12,360
30% of an individual's carbon
footprint in high income
271
00:20:12,360 --> 00:20:16,560
countries.
That's that's significant, but
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00:20:16,640 --> 00:20:19,880
usually less than transport and
heating combined.
273
00:20:21,560 --> 00:20:27,760
Yeah, because still, what wheat
does matter, especially in what
274
00:20:27,760 --> 00:20:31,280
kind of food, because not all
food are creating equal.
275
00:20:32,080 --> 00:20:35,240
Beef is the big one.
Yeah.
276
00:20:37,080 --> 00:20:41,760
A statistic that comes up very
often is that producing 1
277
00:20:42,080 --> 00:20:46,800
kilogram of beef emits roughly
50 to 60 kilogram of CO2
278
00:20:46,800 --> 00:20:49,480
equivalent.
So.
279
00:20:49,640 --> 00:20:55,600
And if we compare that to other
meat, for example pork, 7K of
280
00:20:56,000 --> 00:21:04,000
CO2 per kilogram of meat.
Chicken, 6 kilogram of CO2 per
281
00:21:04,000 --> 00:21:07,440
kilogram of meat.
And what if we're talking about
282
00:21:07,480 --> 00:21:10,840
legumes?
This is 1 to 2 kilogram of CO2
283
00:21:11,520 --> 00:21:13,360
per kilo.
Wow.
284
00:21:13,440 --> 00:21:18,120
So we are, we, we're talking
about a 50 times difference
285
00:21:18,400 --> 00:21:22,520
versus beef and and legumes.
That's an order of magnitude
286
00:21:22,520 --> 00:21:25,320
difference, of course.
Yeah.
287
00:21:25,320 --> 00:21:30,960
So let's put then some numbers
again on individual level.
288
00:21:31,320 --> 00:21:35,200
Yeah, so as we've done before
with cars, with flying, let's
289
00:21:35,200 --> 00:21:39,400
talk about an individual's
footprint related to a food.
290
00:21:40,000 --> 00:21:46,160
A person eating a beef heavy
diet can easily emit 1 1/2 to 2
291
00:21:46,160 --> 00:21:51,720
1/2 tons of CO2 equivalent per
year from food alone.
292
00:21:52,960 --> 00:21:58,360
And sweet sweet shifting to
plant rich diet can cut roughly
293
00:21:58,360 --> 00:22:02,240
enough.
And going fully vegan may reduce
294
00:22:02,240 --> 00:22:05,920
food related emissions by 60 to
70%.
295
00:22:07,600 --> 00:22:10,480
So why doesn't food dominate the
rankings?
296
00:22:13,480 --> 00:22:16,160
Yeah, and, and maybe it's a more
nuanced conversation.
297
00:22:16,160 --> 00:22:23,400
Even a full diet shift usually
saves about 1 to 2 tons of CO2
298
00:22:23,400 --> 00:22:26,400
per year.
And that's meaningful, but still
299
00:22:26,400 --> 00:22:30,320
less than giving up a car or
avoiding long haul flights.
300
00:22:31,600 --> 00:22:36,640
Which is why food is often over
represented in public messaging.
301
00:22:36,720 --> 00:22:40,120
Related relative to its impact.
Yeah.
302
00:22:41,480 --> 00:22:46,440
Another complexity is methane,
and we talk about this with
303
00:22:46,440 --> 00:22:48,520
Georges during an episode last
year.
304
00:22:49,400 --> 00:22:53,440
Yeah, livestock.
It produces methane, which is
305
00:22:54,040 --> 00:22:56,560
much more powerful than CO2 in
the short term.
306
00:22:58,240 --> 00:23:04,240
So reducing remnant meat helps
near term warming even if CO2
307
00:23:04,840 --> 00:23:07,320
numbers look smaller than
transportation.
308
00:23:07,880 --> 00:23:13,680
Yeah, the the biggest food
levers aren't about perfection,
309
00:23:13,680 --> 00:23:16,240
they're about focus.
Yeah.
310
00:23:16,600 --> 00:23:21,400
So 3 high impact moves, eat less
beef and lamb, shift towards
311
00:23:21,440 --> 00:23:24,400
plant rich meals, reduce food
waste.
312
00:23:25,520 --> 00:23:29,520
And food waste alone can account
for 8 to 10% of global
313
00:23:29,800 --> 00:23:32,240
emissions.
So throwing food.
314
00:23:32,240 --> 00:23:34,400
Away is like burning fuel for
nothing.
315
00:23:35,560 --> 00:23:39,760
Right.
And what about how many local
316
00:23:39,760 --> 00:23:43,680
versus imported?
Food, so usually less important
317
00:23:43,680 --> 00:23:49,160
than what you eat.
And about packaging.
318
00:23:49,760 --> 00:23:53,480
This is according to many.
This is tiny compared to the
319
00:23:53,480 --> 00:23:58,320
produce production emissions.
Yeah, this is, this is very
320
00:23:58,320 --> 00:24:01,440
insightful.
So are you noticing the pattern
321
00:24:01,440 --> 00:24:02,320
here?
Yeah.
322
00:24:03,280 --> 00:24:08,320
Route changes are highly
visible, easy to moralize and
323
00:24:08,320 --> 00:24:12,280
politically.
Safe, yeah.
324
00:24:12,280 --> 00:24:17,520
And, and as you can imagine,
they're really the biggest lever
325
00:24:17,520 --> 00:24:19,280
on their own.
Yeah.
326
00:24:20,000 --> 00:24:23,240
So I think it's important we
discuss it, but you also we need
327
00:24:23,240 --> 00:24:27,720
to contextualize and the bigger
features of what are really
328
00:24:27,720 --> 00:24:32,080
delivers to move the needle.
Yeah.
329
00:24:32,600 --> 00:24:36,280
So, so far we have talked about
emissions.
330
00:24:36,280 --> 00:24:41,880
We can see and feel driving,
flying, heating and heating.
331
00:24:42,600 --> 00:24:47,160
But there's another category
that's quieter, less visible,
332
00:24:47,400 --> 00:24:50,200
yet deeply embedded in our
lifestyles, which is
333
00:24:50,200 --> 00:24:53,880
consumption.
Everything we buy carries a
334
00:24:53,880 --> 00:24:57,680
carbon history that usually
stays out of sight.
335
00:24:58,120 --> 00:25:00,160
Yeah, exactly.
When we talk about the
336
00:25:00,160 --> 00:25:03,720
consumption, we're not just
talking about shopping habits in
337
00:25:03,720 --> 00:25:05,920
a moral sense.
We're talking about industrial
338
00:25:05,920 --> 00:25:09,040
supply chains, energy using
factories, raw material
339
00:25:09,040 --> 00:25:12,400
extractions, global shipping,
and often very short product
340
00:25:12,400 --> 00:25:16,240
life spans that lock emissions
in before we can even use the
341
00:25:16,240 --> 00:25:21,840
product.
And in high income countries,
342
00:25:22,160 --> 00:25:26,120
consumption of goods and
services, things like clothes,
343
00:25:26,120 --> 00:25:32,120
electronics, furniture,
appliances can represent 20 to
344
00:25:32,120 --> 00:25:37,680
35% of a person's total CO2
footprint depending on
345
00:25:37,680 --> 00:25:41,400
lifestyle.
And that's what's shrinking is
346
00:25:41,480 --> 00:25:43,920
these emissions are mostly
outsourced.
347
00:25:44,240 --> 00:25:48,640
They don't show up when we
leave, but where things are
348
00:25:48,640 --> 00:25:51,920
produced, often in countries
with more carbon intensive
349
00:25:52,000 --> 00:25:56,280
energy systems.
Yeah, again, a simple example.
350
00:25:56,400 --> 00:26:00,360
Take a smartphone.
Roughly 70 to 80% of its
351
00:26:00,600 --> 00:26:04,800
lifetime emissions happen before
you even turn it on, during the
352
00:26:04,800 --> 00:26:08,640
mining for the components for,
during manufacturing, and during
353
00:26:08,640 --> 00:26:12,480
assembly of the phone.
Which means replacing a phone
354
00:26:12,480 --> 00:26:15,640
every two years instead of every
five years as a much larger
355
00:26:15,640 --> 00:26:19,080
impact than people usually
realize, even if the device
356
00:26:19,080 --> 00:26:24,080
itself is very energy efficient.
Clothing is another powerful
357
00:26:24,080 --> 00:26:26,920
example.
The fashion industry accounts
358
00:26:26,920 --> 00:26:31,760
for 8 to 10% of global
emissions, more than aviation
359
00:26:31,840 --> 00:26:35,880
and shipping combined.
And the fashion industry
360
00:26:35,880 --> 00:26:39,120
accelerate this problem by
shortening use cycles.
361
00:26:39,200 --> 00:26:42,920
Clothes are born fewer times,
discarded faster, and replace
362
00:26:42,920 --> 00:26:46,680
more often, which multiplies
production emissions without
363
00:26:46,680 --> 00:26:52,320
increasing real utility.
Big items like furniture or
364
00:26:52,320 --> 00:26:56,400
household appliances may feel
like one time purchase, but
365
00:26:56,400 --> 00:27:00,040
their carbon impact can be
substantial too, especially when
366
00:27:00,440 --> 00:27:03,720
quality is low and replacement
happens quickly.
367
00:27:04,560 --> 00:27:06,880
Your durability becomes a
climate action.
368
00:27:07,160 --> 00:27:10,000
Buying something once and using
it for 20 years can be
369
00:27:10,000 --> 00:27:12,800
dramatically better than buying
cheaper alternatives multiple
370
00:27:12,800 --> 00:27:14,720
times.
Right.
371
00:27:16,400 --> 00:27:20,800
What's interesting is that
consumption emissions are less
372
00:27:20,800 --> 00:27:28,480
about what we buy and more about
how often we buy and how long we
373
00:27:28,480 --> 00:27:32,240
keep those things.
So the biggest levers are supply
374
00:27:32,240 --> 00:27:35,680
simply simple buying less
overall, extending product
375
00:27:35,680 --> 00:27:38,560
lifetime, repairing instead of
replacing and choosing second
376
00:27:38,600 --> 00:27:44,240
hand when possible.
People often, you know, focus on
377
00:27:44,720 --> 00:27:49,520
things like eco labels or minor
efficiency differences between
378
00:27:49,520 --> 00:27:52,520
products though.
Those can help, but they're
379
00:27:52,520 --> 00:27:56,520
usually 2nd order effects
compared to the sheer impact of
380
00:27:56,520 --> 00:27:59,400
producing something new versus
not producing at all.
381
00:28:00,680 --> 00:28:04,600
Yeah, consumption is where
climate change becomes
382
00:28:04,600 --> 00:28:10,520
uncomfortable because it touches
identity, status and growth
383
00:28:10,520 --> 00:28:14,280
models.
And this also shows the limits
384
00:28:14,280 --> 00:28:16,880
of individual action.
Many consumption partners are
385
00:28:16,880 --> 00:28:19,840
shaped by design choices,
advertising and plan
386
00:28:19,840 --> 00:28:22,160
obsolescence, not just personal
preference.
387
00:28:24,080 --> 00:28:27,760
Yeah.
And as we come to the end of
388
00:28:27,760 --> 00:28:32,480
this episode, I think it's
important to pause for a moment
389
00:28:32,480 --> 00:28:35,440
and look at everything we've
covered together.
390
00:28:36,320 --> 00:28:40,080
We've talked about cars,
flights.
391
00:28:40,600 --> 00:28:44,400
We've talked about homes, food
and consumption.
392
00:28:44,840 --> 00:28:49,160
And one thing becomes very clear
once you start putting numbers
393
00:28:49,640 --> 00:28:54,360
next to these choices,
individual climate impact is not
394
00:28:54,360 --> 00:28:58,040
evenly distributed across our
everyday decisions.
395
00:28:59,360 --> 00:29:01,880
But before anyone walks awaiting
in the recent Universal
396
00:29:01,880 --> 00:29:04,680
checklist on a perfect ranking
that applies to everyone, we
397
00:29:04,680 --> 00:29:08,400
need to say that clearly that
isn't where you live in the
398
00:29:08,400 --> 00:29:09,840
world.
Where you are in a city, in a
399
00:29:09,840 --> 00:29:14,200
rural area, how you electricity
produce your income, even your
400
00:29:14,200 --> 00:29:18,040
climate announcing stock.
All of these factors radically
401
00:29:18,040 --> 00:29:20,440
shape what your personal
footprint looks like.
402
00:29:21,800 --> 00:29:26,440
And that said, when we look at
broad patterns in high income
403
00:29:26,440 --> 00:29:29,880
countries, some trends are
remarkably consistent.
404
00:29:30,360 --> 00:29:34,080
For many people, mobility is the
single biggest driver.
405
00:29:34,320 --> 00:29:38,680
Cars and flights together often
represent 30 to 40% of an
406
00:29:38,680 --> 00:29:43,000
individual's total emissions,
with private cars alone
407
00:29:43,000 --> 00:29:47,440
accounting for 15 to 25%,
depending on distance, vehicle
408
00:29:47,440 --> 00:29:52,600
size and fuel type.
And there is flying which flying
409
00:29:52,600 --> 00:29:54,880
which which can completely
distort the picture.
410
00:29:54,880 --> 00:29:58,440
For someone who flies long or
regularly, aviation can add 20
411
00:29:58,440 --> 00:30:04,520
to 20% more in just a few trips,
effectively overwhelming many of
412
00:30:04,520 --> 00:30:07,480
the smaller day-to-day choices
people tend to focus on.
413
00:30:08,680 --> 00:30:14,400
Yeah, home energy is another
major pillar and again, context
414
00:30:14,960 --> 00:30:20,360
not really is important here.
Heating, cooling, electricity
415
00:30:20,360 --> 00:30:24,280
and electricity typically
account for 20 to 30% of
416
00:30:24,280 --> 00:30:28,000
personal emissions, but that
range can swing dramatically
417
00:30:28,000 --> 00:30:32,800
depending on insulation, climate
and weather energy comes from
418
00:30:32,800 --> 00:30:35,400
fossil fuels or or low carbon
sources.
419
00:30:36,160 --> 00:30:39,040
This is also where some of the
most durable reduction can
420
00:30:39,040 --> 00:30:42,800
happen, because once some is
insulated or electrified, the
421
00:30:42,800 --> 00:30:46,400
savings repeat every single year
without requiring constant
422
00:30:46,400 --> 00:30:50,480
effort.
Food is often where public
423
00:30:50,480 --> 00:30:52,560
conversation starts, and it is
important.
424
00:30:52,960 --> 00:30:57,600
On average, food contributes to
about 20 to 30% of individual
425
00:30:57,600 --> 00:31:02,760
emissions, with beef, dairy and
food waste playing an outsized
426
00:31:02,880 --> 00:31:05,320
role.
Yeah, but again, this is highly
427
00:31:05,320 --> 00:31:08,720
dependent on diets, agricultural
systems and local context.
428
00:31:09,200 --> 00:31:12,200
Reducing beef or food waste can
make a meaningful difference,
429
00:31:12,200 --> 00:31:17,520
especially in the short term,
but this usually doesn't
430
00:31:17,720 --> 00:31:21,000
outweigh the impact of major
transport or energy choices.
431
00:31:22,440 --> 00:31:24,840
And finally, there's there's
consumption.
432
00:31:25,240 --> 00:31:29,560
All of the products, clothes,
electronics and household items
433
00:31:29,560 --> 00:31:34,400
we buy and replace.
Over time, depending on
434
00:31:34,400 --> 00:31:39,760
lifestyle, this can add 20 to
35% of emissions, much of it
435
00:31:39,800 --> 00:31:43,640
hidden in global supply chains
that most of us never get to
436
00:31:43,640 --> 00:31:47,760
see.
Which is why extending the life
437
00:31:47,760 --> 00:31:51,720
of products, repairing instead
of replacing and simply by less
438
00:31:52,040 --> 00:31:55,720
can quietly be some of the most
effective and least visible
439
00:31:56,200 --> 00:32:01,000
climate actions.
Right, so let's take a step
440
00:32:01,600 --> 00:32:04,000
back.
If there is one thing we want
441
00:32:04,120 --> 00:32:08,680
our listeners to take away from
this episode, it's it's not a
442
00:32:08,680 --> 00:32:11,240
rigid ranking or a sense of
guilt.
443
00:32:11,640 --> 00:32:15,160
It's the understanding that
climate impact is shaped by a
444
00:32:15,800 --> 00:32:20,160
handful of big structural
choices, and those choices look
445
00:32:20,160 --> 00:32:23,440
different depending on where you
are and how you live.
446
00:32:24,880 --> 00:32:28,520
And there is no
one-size-fits-all solution, but
447
00:32:28,520 --> 00:32:32,640
there is a common partner.
A small number of decisions
448
00:32:32,640 --> 00:32:37,080
dominate the footprint, while
many highly visible actions play
449
00:32:37,080 --> 00:32:40,120
a much smaller role than what we
tend to assume.
450
00:32:41,480 --> 00:32:47,720
So as we move to the final
reflections of this episode, my
451
00:32:47,720 --> 00:32:51,800
take away is that climate action
at the individual level isn't
452
00:32:51,800 --> 00:32:54,000
about doing everything
perfectly.
453
00:32:55,240 --> 00:32:58,280
It's about focusing on what
actually matters in your context
454
00:32:58,280 --> 00:33:01,640
and recognizing where personal
choices intersect with systems,
455
00:33:01,640 --> 00:33:06,040
infrastructure, and policy.
And and maybe it's about
456
00:33:06,240 --> 00:33:09,960
shifting the conversation away
from guilt.
457
00:33:10,800 --> 00:33:14,440
Yeah, to the worst priorities,
agency and impact.
458
00:33:15,560 --> 00:33:23,640
Right that was the first episode
of the new year of a new season
459
00:33:24,080 --> 00:33:30,440
on sustainability forward.
We hope you've had a very
460
00:33:30,640 --> 00:33:34,240
relaxing break at the end of
2025.
461
00:33:35,080 --> 00:33:39,520
Going forward, we'll look to
bring new episodes on the topic
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00:33:39,520 --> 00:33:43,400
of sustainability.
As always, you can find us on
463
00:33:43,640 --> 00:33:47,600
Sustainability forward.com and
by the same name.
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00:33:47,680 --> 00:33:52,240
We are also on LinkedIn and all
major podcast platforms.
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00:33:52,960 --> 00:33:56,120
This is your host, Rishi,
closing the episode.
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00:33:56,880 --> 00:33:58,360
Thank you, Carmen for joining
me.
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00:33:59,680 --> 00:34:01,840
Thank you Rishi and looking
forward to next episode.
00:00:09,440 --> 00:00:15,320
Welcome to a new episode of
Sustainability Forward, also in
2
00:00:15,320 --> 00:00:20,920
the new year of 2026.
With me is my Co host Carmine
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00:00:21,280 --> 00:00:22,360
Harmony.
How are you doing?
4
00:00:22,920 --> 00:00:25,480
Good Richie, looking forward to
this new year.
5
00:00:26,640 --> 00:00:29,480
Me too, me too.
Lots of things to discuss in the
6
00:00:29,480 --> 00:00:33,800
new year.
So I wanted to come and start by
7
00:00:33,880 --> 00:00:38,240
asking a very simple question,
probably a very pertinent
8
00:00:38,240 --> 00:00:42,840
question for New Year,
specifically for individuals as
9
00:00:42,840 --> 00:00:45,640
well.
When we talk about climate
10
00:00:45,640 --> 00:00:50,080
action as individuals, what's
the first thing that comes to
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00:00:50,080 --> 00:00:53,600
your mind?
Probably is the time when we are
12
00:00:53,600 --> 00:00:59,280
recording, but I would say food,
meat, probably recycling, I
13
00:01:00,560 --> 00:01:04,200
don't know, switching off the
lights, yeah.
14
00:01:04,519 --> 00:01:08,040
My list is similar.
We've sent we spent years
15
00:01:08,040 --> 00:01:13,240
focusing on, you know, the
small, visible, tangible things.
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00:01:14,120 --> 00:01:18,720
The ones that feel manageable
and even comforting sometimes.
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00:01:19,720 --> 00:01:21,920
Yeah.
And I think today we want to ask
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00:01:22,120 --> 00:01:24,920
Professor Lali uncomfortable
questions.
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00:01:25,640 --> 00:01:28,760
Are those the action that really
move the needle?
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00:01:30,800 --> 00:01:35,080
Yeah, good question.
Because as we kind of look into
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00:01:35,080 --> 00:01:38,440
the data, something interesting
comes out.
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00:01:40,280 --> 00:01:44,000
Some everyday habits which you
barely question, like how we
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00:01:44,000 --> 00:01:48,280
move from one place to the
other, how we fly or how often
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00:01:48,280 --> 00:01:54,640
we fly, how we heat our homes,
all that completely dominates
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00:01:54,920 --> 00:02:00,120
our individual climate impact.
Yeah, and they're often missing
26
00:02:00,120 --> 00:02:04,400
from the mainstream conversation
or treated us too hard, too
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00:02:04,400 --> 00:02:07,240
political or too disruptive to
touch.
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00:02:08,800 --> 00:02:14,960
And that's why this episode is
not about being a perfect green
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00:02:14,960 --> 00:02:18,120
consumer.
Yes, let's focus on impact,
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00:02:18,480 --> 00:02:22,240
about understanding which
individual choices matter most
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00:02:22,800 --> 00:02:27,240
and why society tends to talk
about the smaller ones instead.
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00:02:29,080 --> 00:02:33,760
We will today walk through the
biggest drivers of personal
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00:02:33,760 --> 00:02:39,040
admissions 1 by 1, using real
numbers and some real examples.
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00:02:40,200 --> 00:02:43,080
And hopefully by the end of the
episode, you will walk away with
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00:02:43,080 --> 00:02:46,800
a clearer answer to the simple
question, If I want to make a
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00:02:46,800 --> 00:02:50,520
difference, where should I
actually focus my energy?
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00:02:51,960 --> 00:02:56,120
Because climate action isn't
about doing everything.
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00:02:57,040 --> 00:02:58,760
Yes.
And Richie, let's pulling the
39
00:02:58,760 --> 00:03:01,640
right lever, pulling the right
levers first.
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00:03:02,280 --> 00:03:06,920
Yeah.
Our kind of first segment is
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00:03:06,920 --> 00:03:11,120
about cars and mobility, which
we think is actually the
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00:03:11,120 --> 00:03:17,800
biggest, biggest lever.
So let's start with what it is.
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00:03:17,800 --> 00:03:21,800
So for many people, the single
biggest source of emissions in
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00:03:21,800 --> 00:03:25,680
their daily lives is the car.
Yeah.
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00:03:25,800 --> 00:03:28,000
And of course it really depends
on where you live with parts of
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00:03:28,000 --> 00:03:35,760
the world, your daily life.
But for, for example, for from
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00:03:35,760 --> 00:03:40,800
where me and you live, driving
feels normal routine, it's
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00:03:40,800 --> 00:03:44,520
almost invisible.
And probably This is why it's
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00:03:44,520 --> 00:03:47,040
climate impact is often
underestimated.
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00:03:48,240 --> 00:03:51,640
Yeah.
So to make this discussion
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00:03:51,640 --> 00:03:57,960
concrete, let's imagine a fairly
typical driver who drives about
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00:03:57,960 --> 00:04:04,880
20,000 kilometers per year,
gasoline car consuming about 9
53
00:04:05,400 --> 00:04:14,280
liters of gasoline per 100
kilometers and maybe, yeah,
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00:04:15,040 --> 00:04:18,399
consuming about 9 liters per 100
kilometer.
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00:04:20,200 --> 00:04:22,880
Yeah, that's how I would say
that forms kind of the picture
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00:04:22,880 --> 00:04:29,280
of a typical driver.
Yeah, this is around 1800 liters
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00:04:29,280 --> 00:04:33,880
of fuel every day, every year.
Every year, I'd say, yeah, OK.
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00:04:34,560 --> 00:04:40,040
And that translates to about
four tons of CO2 per year just
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00:04:40,040 --> 00:04:46,040
from driving.
So around 4 tons per of CO2 per
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00:04:46,040 --> 00:04:48,000
year.
That's already doubled the
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00:04:48,000 --> 00:04:52,520
annual per person carbon target
carbon budget compatible with
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00:04:52,720 --> 00:04:56,600
1.5° word.
And this even before we start
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00:04:56,600 --> 00:05:02,200
talking about other emissions
such as flight, eating or food.
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00:05:03,760 --> 00:05:08,160
OK, so just with the car, an
average driver has already
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00:05:08,160 --> 00:05:12,200
doubled the budget very, very,
very important take away.
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00:05:12,280 --> 00:05:17,960
OK, so now let's dive into the
SUV effect, right?
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00:05:17,960 --> 00:05:23,320
How bigger heavier emissions
associated with driving are
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00:05:23,320 --> 00:05:26,560
happening.
So when we when we zoom out and
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00:05:26,560 --> 00:05:30,240
look at one of the biggest
trends of the last decade, it is
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00:05:30,240 --> 00:05:35,920
in fact the explosion of SUVs,
the larger, bigger, more gas
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00:05:35,920 --> 00:05:38,760
guzzling cars.
Yes.
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00:05:38,760 --> 00:05:44,120
And interesting to see because
in the last decade, this segment
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00:05:44,120 --> 00:05:48,600
has gone from a niche category
to around half of all new cars
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00:05:48,600 --> 00:05:50,560
sales globally.
Yeah.
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00:05:51,160 --> 00:05:58,960
And on average, these SUVs emit
about 20% more CO2 per kilometer
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00:05:59,120 --> 00:06:05,600
than smaller comparable cars.
Yeah, they're heavier, lesser
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00:06:05,600 --> 00:06:08,720
dynamic most of the time, and
often more powerful.
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00:06:08,720 --> 00:06:11,760
That's what's needed for
everyday driving.
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00:06:13,480 --> 00:06:17,360
And the scale of this trend is
what really matters.
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00:06:17,360 --> 00:06:22,040
You know, there are hundreds of
millions of SUVs on the road
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00:06:22,480 --> 00:06:26,880
worldwide, and depending on the
geography, might be even more
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00:06:26,880 --> 00:06:29,280
dense in some parts of the world
than elsewhere.
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00:06:29,920 --> 00:06:33,080
And probably you've seen this
kind of statistics somewhere
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00:06:33,080 --> 00:06:34,800
else, but I found very
interesting.
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00:06:34,800 --> 00:06:39,400
So if SUV owners were a country,
the combined emission will rank
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00:06:39,400 --> 00:06:43,680
among the Wards top emitters on
the order of magnitude of major
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00:06:43,680 --> 00:06:47,840
industrial economy.
Wow, that's a That's a very
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00:06:47,840 --> 00:06:56,440
striking statistic that vehicle
choice at scale isn't just a
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00:06:56,440 --> 00:07:01,160
marginal issue, it's actually a
climate system issue.
90
00:07:02,720 --> 00:07:06,680
And and crucially, the growth of
SUV has offset a large share of
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00:07:06,680 --> 00:07:10,600
the efficiency gains made by
clear engines, development of
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00:07:10,600 --> 00:07:14,280
technologies etcetera where the
last decade.
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00:07:15,320 --> 00:07:19,720
Right now, the next point of
discussion on the topic of
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00:07:19,720 --> 00:07:24,760
vehicles is around EVs.
At this point, actually, many
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00:07:24,760 --> 00:07:31,120
people will ask, OK, but what if
my car itself is electric?
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00:07:31,120 --> 00:07:32,680
What difference is that going to
make?
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00:07:33,440 --> 00:07:35,880
Yeah, that's a fair question.
We know that an electric engine
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00:07:35,880 --> 00:07:38,720
is more effective than an
internal combustion engine.
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00:07:38,720 --> 00:07:43,200
So E VS do reduce emissions,
especially where electricity is
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00:07:43,200 --> 00:07:48,160
low carbon.
But I think I mean we know there
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00:07:48,160 --> 00:07:51,000
is a hierarchy that often gets
lost in this.
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00:07:51,920 --> 00:07:55,040
Yeah.
So we should say probably no car
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00:07:55,040 --> 00:07:59,600
at all is the scenario from
where your emission got really
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00:07:59,600 --> 00:08:01,600
reduced.
The second best option would be
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00:08:01,600 --> 00:08:03,800
driving much less.
Or if you really need to drive
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00:08:03,800 --> 00:08:08,160
it for work or personal life,
electric car could have a better
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00:08:08,160 --> 00:08:11,800
impact on emissions and only
after that a more efficient
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00:08:11,800 --> 00:08:17,960
fossil car.
So an electric SUV is still
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00:08:17,960 --> 00:08:22,040
heavy, resource intensive and
energy hungry, isn't it?
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00:08:23,120 --> 00:08:27,520
So electric vehicles could help,
but they don't solve congestion,
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00:08:27,600 --> 00:08:30,840
land use and other sheer scale
of car dependence.
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00:08:32,760 --> 00:08:38,120
This is where.
Climate action stops being just
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00:08:38,120 --> 00:08:41,799
about personal choices.
Yeah, because reducing car
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00:08:41,799 --> 00:08:46,080
dependence means rethinking
cities, commuting infrastructure
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00:08:46,080 --> 00:08:52,600
and public transportation.
Which is why it's talked about
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00:08:52,840 --> 00:09:00,480
less than recycling or diet.
But if we are honest about where
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00:09:00,480 --> 00:09:04,160
individual emissions really come
from, mobility is the first
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00:09:04,160 --> 00:09:08,000
place to look, at least in few
parts of the world.
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00:09:09,760 --> 00:09:12,040
Because, as we said in the
beginning, when it comes to
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00:09:12,040 --> 00:09:16,800
climate impact, how we move
matters more than we like to
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00:09:16,800 --> 00:09:22,360
admit.
The second aspect of moving is,
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00:09:22,360 --> 00:09:27,160
of course, flying right?
If cars are the biggest source
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00:09:27,160 --> 00:09:31,280
of emission spread across the
year, flying is slightly
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00:09:31,280 --> 00:09:34,600
different.
Yeah, flying is like hitting the
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00:09:34,600 --> 00:09:37,040
Fast forward button of your
carbon frequent.
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00:09:37,200 --> 00:09:41,400
It's much more dense in shorter
period of time.
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00:09:42,000 --> 00:09:46,400
That's right, you can do
everything right for months.
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00:09:46,960 --> 00:09:51,920
Drive less and eat well.
Optimize your energy consumption
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00:09:52,360 --> 00:09:56,840
and then one long haul flight
can wipe out all of that in a
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00:09:56,840 --> 00:10:00,600
single day.
And let's look at the concrete
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00:10:00,600 --> 00:10:07,040
example, something potentially
from an executive business
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00:10:07,040 --> 00:10:08,720
traveller.
Yeah.
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00:10:09,280 --> 00:10:15,360
So what again, I mean the
scenario that we imagine is 3
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00:10:15,360 --> 00:10:20,800
return long haul flights per
year between London and Houston,
135
00:10:20,800 --> 00:10:25,240
probably this guy works in the
oil and gas industry plus 5
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00:10:25,240 --> 00:10:28,080
medium distance flights within
within Europe.
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00:10:29,680 --> 00:10:36,360
That adds up roughly 6 to 8 tons
per CO2 per year, depending on
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00:10:36,360 --> 00:10:42,400
aircraft type and assumptions.
And that's just from flying
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00:10:42,400 --> 00:10:46,160
because earlier we gave you the
impact from driving as well.
140
00:10:47,000 --> 00:10:49,840
And to put that in perspective,
that's more than the total
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00:10:49,840 --> 00:10:52,880
annual emission of an average
person in many countries.
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00:10:54,480 --> 00:11:00,000
Right now, even within flying
the there's a discussion of
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00:11:00,040 --> 00:11:02,520
economy versus business, class
versus first class.
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00:11:02,520 --> 00:11:06,400
This is where things truly get
uncomfortable because not all
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00:11:06,400 --> 00:11:09,960
seats are equal.
I guess from an emissions
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00:11:09,960 --> 00:11:12,160
perspective as well as from a
price perspective.
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00:11:12,560 --> 00:11:16,480
Yeah, the plane emits roughly
the same total CO2 whatever is
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00:11:16,480 --> 00:11:20,800
full of economy or business
passengers, but.
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00:11:21,280 --> 00:11:25,920
Emissions are allocated per seat
and business and 1st class seats
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00:11:25,920 --> 00:11:28,440
take up much more space and
wait.
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00:11:29,320 --> 00:11:33,920
So one business class passenger
can be responsible for two to
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00:11:33,920 --> 00:11:37,120
four times more emissions than
an economy passengers on the
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00:11:37,120 --> 00:11:40,680
same flight.
And first class obviously can be
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00:11:40,680 --> 00:11:43,680
even higher.
Which means the frequent Flyers
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00:11:43,680 --> 00:11:46,800
in premium cabins have a
disproportionately large climate
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00:11:46,800 --> 00:11:50,160
impact, even if they fly the
same roots.
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00:11:51,360 --> 00:11:55,160
Right.
And as we have always maintained
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00:11:55,200 --> 00:12:02,200
on this podcast, it is not just
about CO2 Aviation impact is
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00:12:02,240 --> 00:12:05,960
much bigger than just the just
the CO2 footprint.
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00:12:07,080 --> 00:12:12,080
Lanes releases emissions high in
atmosphere where they where they
161
00:12:12,080 --> 00:12:18,200
have an extra warming effect.
And then associated with flying
162
00:12:18,960 --> 00:12:23,440
are things like contrails,
nitrogen oxides, which can
163
00:12:23,440 --> 00:12:27,600
amplify warming beyond CO2
alone.
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00:12:29,000 --> 00:12:33,920
So when scientists account for
these non CO2 effects, the total
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00:12:33,920 --> 00:12:38,320
climate impact of flying can be
roughly 2 to three times higher
166
00:12:38,560 --> 00:12:44,720
than CO2 numbers suggest.
Which essentially means that
167
00:12:44,920 --> 00:12:49,160
aviation punches well above its
weight in terms of climate
168
00:12:49,160 --> 00:12:52,320
impact.
So what, Rishi?
169
00:12:52,320 --> 00:12:53,880
So what actually moves the
needle?
170
00:12:54,800 --> 00:12:59,520
Well, again, just like we did
before first flying less,
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00:13:00,000 --> 00:13:05,480
there's no substitute for that.
Yeah.
172
00:13:05,480 --> 00:13:10,720
Second, fewer long haul flights
because longer flights dominate
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00:13:10,720 --> 00:13:12,200
emissions.
Yeah.
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00:13:12,480 --> 00:13:18,200
And the third in that order
would be choosing economy over
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premium cabins when flying is
unavoidable.
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00:13:22,440 --> 00:13:24,800
Yeah.
And we know the aviation
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00:13:24,800 --> 00:13:28,720
industry is moving forward with
sustainable aviation fuel,
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00:13:28,720 --> 00:13:32,560
developing other technology.
This is helpful but there is
179
00:13:32,560 --> 00:13:35,680
still lot of work to do there.
Yeah.
180
00:13:36,240 --> 00:13:42,520
And I don't think carbon flying
is that bad because it's it's
181
00:13:42,520 --> 00:13:45,480
occasional.
Yeah, it's, as we said, it's
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00:13:45,480 --> 00:13:49,640
extremely emission intensive per
hour, very intense.
183
00:13:50,560 --> 00:13:56,640
Yeah, or I think a relatively
small number of people, aviation
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00:13:56,640 --> 00:14:01,680
alone can account for the
majority of their entire carbon
185
00:14:01,680 --> 00:14:04,640
footprint.
This is why when we talk about
186
00:14:04,640 --> 00:14:08,080
individual climate action,
flying always shows up near the
187
00:14:08,080 --> 00:14:10,440
top of the list.
Right.
188
00:14:12,080 --> 00:14:16,480
Let's move to another
interesting segment about which
189
00:14:16,480 --> 00:14:19,680
we've had some discussion on
this podcast in the last season.
190
00:14:20,480 --> 00:14:25,840
After cars and flying, there's a
big source of emissions that
191
00:14:25,920 --> 00:14:30,720
that's much less visible because
it happens quietly when we are
192
00:14:30,720 --> 00:14:32,600
at home and even when we are
not.
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00:14:32,600 --> 00:14:37,720
At home and we did an episode
about it about home energy and
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00:14:37,720 --> 00:14:40,680
heating.
Yes, we did.
195
00:14:41,680 --> 00:14:45,680
No drama, no engines, no airport
queue queues.
196
00:14:45,960 --> 00:14:51,280
And yet, for many household,
it's one of the largest sources
197
00:14:51,280 --> 00:14:55,200
of emissions.
So, and again, it depends on
198
00:14:55,200 --> 00:14:59,600
geographies, but we when we look
at, for example, Europe and
199
00:14:59,600 --> 00:15:03,880
North America, space heating and
hot water dominate the household
200
00:15:03,880 --> 00:15:08,240
energy use.
And in in many other countries.
201
00:15:08,280 --> 00:15:12,640
And that still means gas, oil,
or even coal.
202
00:15:13,600 --> 00:15:16,400
Burning fuel everyday all winter
long.
203
00:15:18,360 --> 00:15:24,320
A typical gas heated home can
easily emit 2 to 4 four tons of
204
00:15:24,320 --> 00:15:30,600
CO2 per year just for heating,
hot just for heating and for and
205
00:15:30,600 --> 00:15:33,880
for hot water.
Which is the same league as
206
00:15:33,880 --> 00:15:37,760
driving a car 10s of thousands
of kilometers, as we said
207
00:15:37,760 --> 00:15:43,160
before.
Yes, now the tricky part is that
208
00:15:43,160 --> 00:15:45,320
heating is the background
activity.
209
00:15:45,760 --> 00:15:48,400
Yeah.
So you have it on but but you
210
00:15:48,400 --> 00:15:51,680
don't feel it like you feel
driving or flying because you're
211
00:15:51,680 --> 00:15:55,400
not focusing on it.
Yeah, you casually set the
212
00:15:56,000 --> 00:15:59,960
thermostat once and the
emissions just keep flowing.
213
00:16:01,520 --> 00:16:06,560
And This is why eating is often
underestimating personal carbon
214
00:16:06,560 --> 00:16:08,800
footprint.
But it's also good to see a lot
215
00:16:08,800 --> 00:16:14,200
of companies moving this space
with intelligence, for example,
216
00:16:14,200 --> 00:16:18,320
temperature settings leveraging
AI technologies.
217
00:16:19,040 --> 00:16:23,200
Right.
So now within this segment, so
218
00:16:23,920 --> 00:16:29,720
heating, let's talk about what
really makes a difference.
219
00:16:30,760 --> 00:16:34,840
Yeah.
So for example, we know our
220
00:16:34,880 --> 00:16:39,600
energy efficiency is important,
so we can we can look at
221
00:16:40,560 --> 00:16:44,080
insulation for example.
Yes we can.
222
00:16:44,600 --> 00:16:51,600
Better insulation can can cut
heating by almost 30 to 60%,
223
00:16:51,600 --> 00:16:57,360
sometimes even more.
So that's not a left cycle
224
00:16:57,360 --> 00:16:59,640
sacrifice, that's a structural.
Fix.
225
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Yeah, it is a structural fix and
and it's something that needs to
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00:17:05,480 --> 00:17:09,200
be done.
The single biggest shift in this
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00:17:09,200 --> 00:17:14,240
segment, however, is moving from
fossil fuel based heating to
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00:17:14,240 --> 00:17:18,000
heat pumps.
Yeah, and if you remember the
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00:17:18,000 --> 00:17:20,599
episode we did also with Sylvan
last year, it pumps are
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00:17:20,599 --> 00:17:23,800
incredibly efficient, often
delivered in three to four units
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00:17:23,800 --> 00:17:26,200
of heat for every unit of
electricity.
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00:17:27,040 --> 00:17:30,160
Yeah.
And as the electricity grid gets
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00:17:30,160 --> 00:17:34,680
cleaner, heating emissions
automatically fall.
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00:17:34,680 --> 00:17:36,760
So it's on.
It almost has a positive
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00:17:37,560 --> 00:17:42,000
positive cycle when the grid
gets cleaner.
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00:17:43,120 --> 00:17:45,920
And the differently from around
there, let's say application
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00:17:45,920 --> 00:17:49,000
industries, the technology is
there is ready to go.
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00:17:49,760 --> 00:17:56,080
Yeah, right.
And then we come to behaviors
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00:17:56,080 --> 00:17:59,640
related to heating, because
small changes still matter.
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00:18:02,280 --> 00:18:05,240
So looking at some statistics
there, for example, lowering the
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00:18:05,280 --> 00:18:10,760
thermostat by 1°C can reduce the
heating emissions by around 7%.
242
00:18:11,720 --> 00:18:17,200
But and and this is an important
but behavior helps most after
243
00:18:17,200 --> 00:18:19,920
the system itself is clean.
Yeah.
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00:18:21,160 --> 00:18:23,600
So it is a partner we're seeing
again.
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00:18:25,680 --> 00:18:29,640
The as we've said again many,
many times in the episode in in
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00:18:29,640 --> 00:18:34,640
many, many areas, the biggest
wins aren't about big, massive
247
00:18:34,640 --> 00:18:38,720
choices, heroics or discipline.
It's.
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00:18:38,720 --> 00:18:43,880
About changing the system once
than letting it work everyday.
249
00:18:44,600 --> 00:18:49,480
So insulate once, electrify
once, decarbonize the grid once,
250
00:18:49,480 --> 00:18:51,320
to name a few.
Yeah.
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00:18:51,320 --> 00:18:53,800
And the savings repeat year
after year.
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00:18:55,120 --> 00:19:01,280
So you've never seen viral posts
about insulation because it's a
253
00:19:01,280 --> 00:19:03,760
boring topic?
Yeah.
254
00:19:03,760 --> 00:19:07,880
And that's also probably not
easy to understand sometimes.
255
00:19:09,040 --> 00:19:11,440
No one flexes an heat pump on
social media.
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00:19:11,480 --> 00:19:15,320
It's, as you said, consider
importing technology, but it's
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00:19:15,320 --> 00:19:17,400
quite effective.
Yeah.
258
00:19:17,680 --> 00:19:20,920
I mean, we did try to talk about
your heat pump experience on on
259
00:19:20,920 --> 00:19:23,680
this podcast.
So maybe maybe we are a bit
260
00:19:23,680 --> 00:19:26,040
different from the rest of the
crowd.
261
00:19:26,360 --> 00:19:31,760
But in terms of climate impact,
heating upgrades are often more
262
00:19:31,760 --> 00:19:35,720
powerful than many visible green
habits combined.
263
00:19:37,200 --> 00:19:41,280
So let's go to a different
segment now, Rich.
264
00:19:41,760 --> 00:19:48,360
Yeah, let's go to food and diet.
After cars, flights and heating
265
00:19:48,360 --> 00:19:51,200
that we've talked about, let's
talk a little bit about food
266
00:19:51,200 --> 00:19:53,720
itself.
Probably the area where climate
267
00:19:53,720 --> 00:19:59,480
conversation get emotional.
Yeah, and where guilt often runs
268
00:19:59,480 --> 00:20:02,040
ahead of ahead of data.
Yeah.
269
00:20:02,400 --> 00:20:07,960
So looking at some statistics,
food accounts for about 20 to
270
00:20:07,960 --> 00:20:12,360
30% of an individual's carbon
footprint in high income
271
00:20:12,360 --> 00:20:16,560
countries.
That's that's significant, but
272
00:20:16,640 --> 00:20:19,880
usually less than transport and
heating combined.
273
00:20:21,560 --> 00:20:27,760
Yeah, because still, what wheat
does matter, especially in what
274
00:20:27,760 --> 00:20:31,280
kind of food, because not all
food are creating equal.
275
00:20:32,080 --> 00:20:35,240
Beef is the big one.
Yeah.
276
00:20:37,080 --> 00:20:41,760
A statistic that comes up very
often is that producing 1
277
00:20:42,080 --> 00:20:46,800
kilogram of beef emits roughly
50 to 60 kilogram of CO2
278
00:20:46,800 --> 00:20:49,480
equivalent.
So.
279
00:20:49,640 --> 00:20:55,600
And if we compare that to other
meat, for example pork, 7K of
280
00:20:56,000 --> 00:21:04,000
CO2 per kilogram of meat.
Chicken, 6 kilogram of CO2 per
281
00:21:04,000 --> 00:21:07,440
kilogram of meat.
And what if we're talking about
282
00:21:07,480 --> 00:21:10,840
legumes?
This is 1 to 2 kilogram of CO2
283
00:21:11,520 --> 00:21:13,360
per kilo.
Wow.
284
00:21:13,440 --> 00:21:18,120
So we are, we, we're talking
about a 50 times difference
285
00:21:18,400 --> 00:21:22,520
versus beef and and legumes.
That's an order of magnitude
286
00:21:22,520 --> 00:21:25,320
difference, of course.
Yeah.
287
00:21:25,320 --> 00:21:30,960
So let's put then some numbers
again on individual level.
288
00:21:31,320 --> 00:21:35,200
Yeah, so as we've done before
with cars, with flying, let's
289
00:21:35,200 --> 00:21:39,400
talk about an individual's
footprint related to a food.
290
00:21:40,000 --> 00:21:46,160
A person eating a beef heavy
diet can easily emit 1 1/2 to 2
291
00:21:46,160 --> 00:21:51,720
1/2 tons of CO2 equivalent per
year from food alone.
292
00:21:52,960 --> 00:21:58,360
And sweet sweet shifting to
plant rich diet can cut roughly
293
00:21:58,360 --> 00:22:02,240
enough.
And going fully vegan may reduce
294
00:22:02,240 --> 00:22:05,920
food related emissions by 60 to
70%.
295
00:22:07,600 --> 00:22:10,480
So why doesn't food dominate the
rankings?
296
00:22:13,480 --> 00:22:16,160
Yeah, and, and maybe it's a more
nuanced conversation.
297
00:22:16,160 --> 00:22:23,400
Even a full diet shift usually
saves about 1 to 2 tons of CO2
298
00:22:23,400 --> 00:22:26,400
per year.
And that's meaningful, but still
299
00:22:26,400 --> 00:22:30,320
less than giving up a car or
avoiding long haul flights.
300
00:22:31,600 --> 00:22:36,640
Which is why food is often over
represented in public messaging.
301
00:22:36,720 --> 00:22:40,120
Related relative to its impact.
Yeah.
302
00:22:41,480 --> 00:22:46,440
Another complexity is methane,
and we talk about this with
303
00:22:46,440 --> 00:22:48,520
Georges during an episode last
year.
304
00:22:49,400 --> 00:22:53,440
Yeah, livestock.
It produces methane, which is
305
00:22:54,040 --> 00:22:56,560
much more powerful than CO2 in
the short term.
306
00:22:58,240 --> 00:23:04,240
So reducing remnant meat helps
near term warming even if CO2
307
00:23:04,840 --> 00:23:07,320
numbers look smaller than
transportation.
308
00:23:07,880 --> 00:23:13,680
Yeah, the the biggest food
levers aren't about perfection,
309
00:23:13,680 --> 00:23:16,240
they're about focus.
Yeah.
310
00:23:16,600 --> 00:23:21,400
So 3 high impact moves, eat less
beef and lamb, shift towards
311
00:23:21,440 --> 00:23:24,400
plant rich meals, reduce food
waste.
312
00:23:25,520 --> 00:23:29,520
And food waste alone can account
for 8 to 10% of global
313
00:23:29,800 --> 00:23:32,240
emissions.
So throwing food.
314
00:23:32,240 --> 00:23:34,400
Away is like burning fuel for
nothing.
315
00:23:35,560 --> 00:23:39,760
Right.
And what about how many local
316
00:23:39,760 --> 00:23:43,680
versus imported?
Food, so usually less important
317
00:23:43,680 --> 00:23:49,160
than what you eat.
And about packaging.
318
00:23:49,760 --> 00:23:53,480
This is according to many.
This is tiny compared to the
319
00:23:53,480 --> 00:23:58,320
produce production emissions.
Yeah, this is, this is very
320
00:23:58,320 --> 00:24:01,440
insightful.
So are you noticing the pattern
321
00:24:01,440 --> 00:24:02,320
here?
Yeah.
322
00:24:03,280 --> 00:24:08,320
Route changes are highly
visible, easy to moralize and
323
00:24:08,320 --> 00:24:12,280
politically.
Safe, yeah.
324
00:24:12,280 --> 00:24:17,520
And, and as you can imagine,
they're really the biggest lever
325
00:24:17,520 --> 00:24:19,280
on their own.
Yeah.
326
00:24:20,000 --> 00:24:23,240
So I think it's important we
discuss it, but you also we need
327
00:24:23,240 --> 00:24:27,720
to contextualize and the bigger
features of what are really
328
00:24:27,720 --> 00:24:32,080
delivers to move the needle.
Yeah.
329
00:24:32,600 --> 00:24:36,280
So, so far we have talked about
emissions.
330
00:24:36,280 --> 00:24:41,880
We can see and feel driving,
flying, heating and heating.
331
00:24:42,600 --> 00:24:47,160
But there's another category
that's quieter, less visible,
332
00:24:47,400 --> 00:24:50,200
yet deeply embedded in our
lifestyles, which is
333
00:24:50,200 --> 00:24:53,880
consumption.
Everything we buy carries a
334
00:24:53,880 --> 00:24:57,680
carbon history that usually
stays out of sight.
335
00:24:58,120 --> 00:25:00,160
Yeah, exactly.
When we talk about the
336
00:25:00,160 --> 00:25:03,720
consumption, we're not just
talking about shopping habits in
337
00:25:03,720 --> 00:25:05,920
a moral sense.
We're talking about industrial
338
00:25:05,920 --> 00:25:09,040
supply chains, energy using
factories, raw material
339
00:25:09,040 --> 00:25:12,400
extractions, global shipping,
and often very short product
340
00:25:12,400 --> 00:25:16,240
life spans that lock emissions
in before we can even use the
341
00:25:16,240 --> 00:25:21,840
product.
And in high income countries,
342
00:25:22,160 --> 00:25:26,120
consumption of goods and
services, things like clothes,
343
00:25:26,120 --> 00:25:32,120
electronics, furniture,
appliances can represent 20 to
344
00:25:32,120 --> 00:25:37,680
35% of a person's total CO2
footprint depending on
345
00:25:37,680 --> 00:25:41,400
lifestyle.
And that's what's shrinking is
346
00:25:41,480 --> 00:25:43,920
these emissions are mostly
outsourced.
347
00:25:44,240 --> 00:25:48,640
They don't show up when we
leave, but where things are
348
00:25:48,640 --> 00:25:51,920
produced, often in countries
with more carbon intensive
349
00:25:52,000 --> 00:25:56,280
energy systems.
Yeah, again, a simple example.
350
00:25:56,400 --> 00:26:00,360
Take a smartphone.
Roughly 70 to 80% of its
351
00:26:00,600 --> 00:26:04,800
lifetime emissions happen before
you even turn it on, during the
352
00:26:04,800 --> 00:26:08,640
mining for the components for,
during manufacturing, and during
353
00:26:08,640 --> 00:26:12,480
assembly of the phone.
Which means replacing a phone
354
00:26:12,480 --> 00:26:15,640
every two years instead of every
five years as a much larger
355
00:26:15,640 --> 00:26:19,080
impact than people usually
realize, even if the device
356
00:26:19,080 --> 00:26:24,080
itself is very energy efficient.
Clothing is another powerful
357
00:26:24,080 --> 00:26:26,920
example.
The fashion industry accounts
358
00:26:26,920 --> 00:26:31,760
for 8 to 10% of global
emissions, more than aviation
359
00:26:31,840 --> 00:26:35,880
and shipping combined.
And the fashion industry
360
00:26:35,880 --> 00:26:39,120
accelerate this problem by
shortening use cycles.
361
00:26:39,200 --> 00:26:42,920
Clothes are born fewer times,
discarded faster, and replace
362
00:26:42,920 --> 00:26:46,680
more often, which multiplies
production emissions without
363
00:26:46,680 --> 00:26:52,320
increasing real utility.
Big items like furniture or
364
00:26:52,320 --> 00:26:56,400
household appliances may feel
like one time purchase, but
365
00:26:56,400 --> 00:27:00,040
their carbon impact can be
substantial too, especially when
366
00:27:00,440 --> 00:27:03,720
quality is low and replacement
happens quickly.
367
00:27:04,560 --> 00:27:06,880
Your durability becomes a
climate action.
368
00:27:07,160 --> 00:27:10,000
Buying something once and using
it for 20 years can be
369
00:27:10,000 --> 00:27:12,800
dramatically better than buying
cheaper alternatives multiple
370
00:27:12,800 --> 00:27:14,720
times.
Right.
371
00:27:16,400 --> 00:27:20,800
What's interesting is that
consumption emissions are less
372
00:27:20,800 --> 00:27:28,480
about what we buy and more about
how often we buy and how long we
373
00:27:28,480 --> 00:27:32,240
keep those things.
So the biggest levers are supply
374
00:27:32,240 --> 00:27:35,680
simply simple buying less
overall, extending product
375
00:27:35,680 --> 00:27:38,560
lifetime, repairing instead of
replacing and choosing second
376
00:27:38,600 --> 00:27:44,240
hand when possible.
People often, you know, focus on
377
00:27:44,720 --> 00:27:49,520
things like eco labels or minor
efficiency differences between
378
00:27:49,520 --> 00:27:52,520
products though.
Those can help, but they're
379
00:27:52,520 --> 00:27:56,520
usually 2nd order effects
compared to the sheer impact of
380
00:27:56,520 --> 00:27:59,400
producing something new versus
not producing at all.
381
00:28:00,680 --> 00:28:04,600
Yeah, consumption is where
climate change becomes
382
00:28:04,600 --> 00:28:10,520
uncomfortable because it touches
identity, status and growth
383
00:28:10,520 --> 00:28:14,280
models.
And this also shows the limits
384
00:28:14,280 --> 00:28:16,880
of individual action.
Many consumption partners are
385
00:28:16,880 --> 00:28:19,840
shaped by design choices,
advertising and plan
386
00:28:19,840 --> 00:28:22,160
obsolescence, not just personal
preference.
387
00:28:24,080 --> 00:28:27,760
Yeah.
And as we come to the end of
388
00:28:27,760 --> 00:28:32,480
this episode, I think it's
important to pause for a moment
389
00:28:32,480 --> 00:28:35,440
and look at everything we've
covered together.
390
00:28:36,320 --> 00:28:40,080
We've talked about cars,
flights.
391
00:28:40,600 --> 00:28:44,400
We've talked about homes, food
and consumption.
392
00:28:44,840 --> 00:28:49,160
And one thing becomes very clear
once you start putting numbers
393
00:28:49,640 --> 00:28:54,360
next to these choices,
individual climate impact is not
394
00:28:54,360 --> 00:28:58,040
evenly distributed across our
everyday decisions.
395
00:28:59,360 --> 00:29:01,880
But before anyone walks awaiting
in the recent Universal
396
00:29:01,880 --> 00:29:04,680
checklist on a perfect ranking
that applies to everyone, we
397
00:29:04,680 --> 00:29:08,400
need to say that clearly that
isn't where you live in the
398
00:29:08,400 --> 00:29:09,840
world.
Where you are in a city, in a
399
00:29:09,840 --> 00:29:14,200
rural area, how you electricity
produce your income, even your
400
00:29:14,200 --> 00:29:18,040
climate announcing stock.
All of these factors radically
401
00:29:18,040 --> 00:29:20,440
shape what your personal
footprint looks like.
402
00:29:21,800 --> 00:29:26,440
And that said, when we look at
broad patterns in high income
403
00:29:26,440 --> 00:29:29,880
countries, some trends are
remarkably consistent.
404
00:29:30,360 --> 00:29:34,080
For many people, mobility is the
single biggest driver.
405
00:29:34,320 --> 00:29:38,680
Cars and flights together often
represent 30 to 40% of an
406
00:29:38,680 --> 00:29:43,000
individual's total emissions,
with private cars alone
407
00:29:43,000 --> 00:29:47,440
accounting for 15 to 25%,
depending on distance, vehicle
408
00:29:47,440 --> 00:29:52,600
size and fuel type.
And there is flying which flying
409
00:29:52,600 --> 00:29:54,880
which which can completely
distort the picture.
410
00:29:54,880 --> 00:29:58,440
For someone who flies long or
regularly, aviation can add 20
411
00:29:58,440 --> 00:30:04,520
to 20% more in just a few trips,
effectively overwhelming many of
412
00:30:04,520 --> 00:30:07,480
the smaller day-to-day choices
people tend to focus on.
413
00:30:08,680 --> 00:30:14,400
Yeah, home energy is another
major pillar and again, context
414
00:30:14,960 --> 00:30:20,360
not really is important here.
Heating, cooling, electricity
415
00:30:20,360 --> 00:30:24,280
and electricity typically
account for 20 to 30% of
416
00:30:24,280 --> 00:30:28,000
personal emissions, but that
range can swing dramatically
417
00:30:28,000 --> 00:30:32,800
depending on insulation, climate
and weather energy comes from
418
00:30:32,800 --> 00:30:35,400
fossil fuels or or low carbon
sources.
419
00:30:36,160 --> 00:30:39,040
This is also where some of the
most durable reduction can
420
00:30:39,040 --> 00:30:42,800
happen, because once some is
insulated or electrified, the
421
00:30:42,800 --> 00:30:46,400
savings repeat every single year
without requiring constant
422
00:30:46,400 --> 00:30:50,480
effort.
Food is often where public
423
00:30:50,480 --> 00:30:52,560
conversation starts, and it is
important.
424
00:30:52,960 --> 00:30:57,600
On average, food contributes to
about 20 to 30% of individual
425
00:30:57,600 --> 00:31:02,760
emissions, with beef, dairy and
food waste playing an outsized
426
00:31:02,880 --> 00:31:05,320
role.
Yeah, but again, this is highly
427
00:31:05,320 --> 00:31:08,720
dependent on diets, agricultural
systems and local context.
428
00:31:09,200 --> 00:31:12,200
Reducing beef or food waste can
make a meaningful difference,
429
00:31:12,200 --> 00:31:17,520
especially in the short term,
but this usually doesn't
430
00:31:17,720 --> 00:31:21,000
outweigh the impact of major
transport or energy choices.
431
00:31:22,440 --> 00:31:24,840
And finally, there's there's
consumption.
432
00:31:25,240 --> 00:31:29,560
All of the products, clothes,
electronics and household items
433
00:31:29,560 --> 00:31:34,400
we buy and replace.
Over time, depending on
434
00:31:34,400 --> 00:31:39,760
lifestyle, this can add 20 to
35% of emissions, much of it
435
00:31:39,800 --> 00:31:43,640
hidden in global supply chains
that most of us never get to
436
00:31:43,640 --> 00:31:47,760
see.
Which is why extending the life
437
00:31:47,760 --> 00:31:51,720
of products, repairing instead
of replacing and simply by less
438
00:31:52,040 --> 00:31:55,720
can quietly be some of the most
effective and least visible
439
00:31:56,200 --> 00:32:01,000
climate actions.
Right, so let's take a step
440
00:32:01,600 --> 00:32:04,000
back.
If there is one thing we want
441
00:32:04,120 --> 00:32:08,680
our listeners to take away from
this episode, it's it's not a
442
00:32:08,680 --> 00:32:11,240
rigid ranking or a sense of
guilt.
443
00:32:11,640 --> 00:32:15,160
It's the understanding that
climate impact is shaped by a
444
00:32:15,800 --> 00:32:20,160
handful of big structural
choices, and those choices look
445
00:32:20,160 --> 00:32:23,440
different depending on where you
are and how you live.
446
00:32:24,880 --> 00:32:28,520
And there is no
one-size-fits-all solution, but
447
00:32:28,520 --> 00:32:32,640
there is a common partner.
A small number of decisions
448
00:32:32,640 --> 00:32:37,080
dominate the footprint, while
many highly visible actions play
449
00:32:37,080 --> 00:32:40,120
a much smaller role than what we
tend to assume.
450
00:32:41,480 --> 00:32:47,720
So as we move to the final
reflections of this episode, my
451
00:32:47,720 --> 00:32:51,800
take away is that climate action
at the individual level isn't
452
00:32:51,800 --> 00:32:54,000
about doing everything
perfectly.
453
00:32:55,240 --> 00:32:58,280
It's about focusing on what
actually matters in your context
454
00:32:58,280 --> 00:33:01,640
and recognizing where personal
choices intersect with systems,
455
00:33:01,640 --> 00:33:06,040
infrastructure, and policy.
And and maybe it's about
456
00:33:06,240 --> 00:33:09,960
shifting the conversation away
from guilt.
457
00:33:10,800 --> 00:33:14,440
Yeah, to the worst priorities,
agency and impact.
458
00:33:15,560 --> 00:33:23,640
Right that was the first episode
of the new year of a new season
459
00:33:24,080 --> 00:33:30,440
on sustainability forward.
We hope you've had a very
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00:33:30,640 --> 00:33:34,240
relaxing break at the end of
2025.
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00:33:35,080 --> 00:33:39,520
Going forward, we'll look to
bring new episodes on the topic
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00:33:39,520 --> 00:33:43,400
of sustainability.
As always, you can find us on
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00:33:43,640 --> 00:33:47,600
Sustainability forward.com and
by the same name.
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00:33:47,680 --> 00:33:52,240
We are also on LinkedIn and all
major podcast platforms.
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This is your host, Rishi,
closing the episode.
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00:33:56,880 --> 00:33:58,360
Thank you, Carmen for joining
me.
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00:33:59,680 --> 00:34:01,840
Thank you Rishi and looking
forward to next episode.
